I had an experience last night that has furthered my resolve on prices and value.
I met a Playboy Model/actress/covergirl last night who unfortunately must remain nameless. I was referred by a friend who told me she wasn't to be missed, and on his say-so I decided to go ahead with the meeting.
The lady called me the next day, and arrangements were made to meet at her hotel and then go to dinner. She told me that she liked to get to know the person she was with, and would like to spend the evening with me without putting a predetermined limit on how long, although she made it clear that it would be a full evening.
When I got to her room and she opened the door, she was stunning.... as beautiful as you'd expect a Playmate to be, and dressed tastefully but sexy as hell.... a low-cut top, a short but not too short skirt and calf-length high heeled boots. We shared the bottle of wine I had brought and got to know each other until it was time to head off to dinner. She took my hand in hers as we walked to the nearby restaurant. Needless to say, most of the male eyes in the restaurant (and a lot of the female's as well) were on her as we where shown to our table. The chairs were opposite each other, but she moved her's to the side to be closer to me... We shared a great meal and great conversation... the lady was smart, funny and engaging... When we got back to her hotel, she moved close to me in the elevator and we kissed...
Back in her room, the experience was the equal of any pornstar I've met... the ultimate GFE, with all the acronyms that implies, and although not the over-the-top kind of PSE like with a Kathy Willets or a Keisha, it was intensely passionate and for our time together I felt like her only goal was to please me to the fullest, which she did in spades... her phone rang once, but she ignored it.
When I had reached the point of exhaustion, I surrendered and got dressed... but the decision to leave was mine... she never indicated that our time was nearing it's completion... I think she'd have gone on and on... but I had to work the next day, and so I finally left at around 2:15 am.
The cost of this once-in-a-lifetime experience? $3000.
Now how could I ever again justify paying $2500 for an hour with any woman?
They don't have to justify their asking rate. No one is holding a gun to our wallets to spend money on any provider, porn star or otherwise. Many factors enter into an asking price including supply and demand along with the provider's financial needs. Providers with prices in the thousands per hour either meet the client's needs both physically and fantasy wise or there are too many people who can afford those prices without investigating performance via boards like TER.
Your new found revelation does not bode well for the high priced porn-stars. I wonder how many hobbyists get burned out on the "porn-star" thing because they find that once it becomes familiar the high end escort is just as good if not a better value?
but that's not the case with most hobbyist. Since you didn't state how you arranged this meeting, direct, agency, private or backchannel connection, and the fact that it was a Playboy/Model quality experience that you could not identify, it is unlikely that most hobbyist could get the hookup with this level of provider at that price.
In my experiences, so far, this type of experience is easily obtainable with independent and very high quality "Non-PSE providers", but is obviously available. I recently had a 6+ hour experience with an x-PSE that I've wanted to see for several years at 1.8k, for the typical PSE/GFE experience, but she is playing down her public image and it was an unexpected connection. (Looked like her, took the chance and was rewarded)
It is all a matter of personal choice and desire as to what a hobbyist will pay or look for. I was recently advised that one of my ATF is available via a backchannel connection, but only for 10k for an evening. An expensive and tough decision that I haven't made yet, but am still considering. Tougher decision when I still haven't had the time to see Miko or Bamboo yet, but not for the lack of trying.
I don't really want to spend more than 1k per hr, let alone 2.5k per for these types of experiences, especially when I only do 2-4 hr minimum meetings. But for that once in a lifetime PSE/Playboy/Model type meeting, and if you have the means, I think we all would do it for the right lady/PSE/GFE.
In any event, JMHO.
Take Care,
SoCalTroy
The fact is this... almost EVERYONE on this board can do exactly what I do and see the very same providers I see and for the same rates that I pay
IF....
They're willing to spend the time to do the research on the internet, and to cultivate email relationships with experienced hobbyists like myself, Seth, Score, San Te, et. al. Most all of the well known posters are more than willing to freely share information with others, with a few caveats.
One... Don't email us with a one or two line message asking "Please tell me how to contact so-and-so directly"... Introduce yourself, mention what your "handle" is on the various boards, hell, even flatter us a little.... Try to engage us in a conversation rather than just a "gimmie info" letter. And if you have some hush-hush info of your own, dangle it in front of us ... Quid Pro Quo is always appreciated.
Two... If it's someone other than a pornstar, meaning Playmates, Pets, actresses, etc. or any celebrity escort who "flies under the radar", don't bother asking us for confidential info. If we have no idea who you are, we're not going to share it.... instead, ask for some advice regarding how to obtain the information ON YOUR OWN. I've pointed many people in the right direction toward what agencies to deal with for models, as well as giving tips on where to meet Playmates/Pets/Models and how to approach them, how to find their direct email addresses, how to word an email, etc. etc.
Three... Spend some time doing some legwork yourself... with a little effort, you'll find that there's a lot of info on the net about so called "discrete" adult performers, models and pornstars alike... A WHOLE lot of it's out there if you take the time to look. It's not necessarily easy, but it's there.
For example; I heard a rumor about a model who might be available... she had a website, but I know that many of the ladies don't really answer their own email sent to their site, and even some that do will not discuss escorting via their fan site. It's a good place to start though, so I gave it a try to no avail. Next I began searching a lot of the modeling sites I found through a google search. Not the model agencies, since they want you to contact them to book the girl. But there are a ton of sites that the girls themselves post their modeling resumes on and have their private emails listed so you can contact them directly for possible acting or modeling assignments. I finally tracked down her email, contacted her, and eventually had a great time with her at a surprisingly low price.
I'm not going to go into the specifics of email techniques, except to say that it's usually not a one email kind of thing,,, you have to establish some trust and rapport before asking the "Big Question"... but one thing I'll say is that if you email a model and you're not offering an assignment, and she's still willing to exchange communications with you, there's a good chance that she's available and if you handle things right, you'll hook up.
I'm not wealthy... I budget for my experiences, and I don't have carte blanc access to all the millionaire's clubs and vip sites. I started out in this hobby a little over two years ago, and have achieved the level of knowledge I have by using my brains and a whole lot of blood, sweat and tears.
If I can do it, anyone can.
Oh, and by the way; in spite of everything I said above, I guarantee that I'll get one or two emails from people who saw the words "Playmates" or "actresses", asking for a list of their names - it never fails - lol.
-- Modified on 11/1/2002 10:57:20 PM
-- Modified on 11/1/2002 11:02:51 PM
FastEddie51:
Agree and glad you made this post, as it shows everyone the legwork involved to achieve the results or get the meetings you and others do.
I myself have been playing in the overall hobby for close to 10 years now, but have only been participating in the Porn Star arena for a little over a year since Doc convinced me to try to see Kianna who was my first PSE(LUV YA K!).
"Hearing" the messages on the boards, publicly and PM messaging with more Senior hobbyist like yourself, Doc, San Te, Score, etc., etc. has been the key for me to learn about this hobby, but I still consider myself a "sophmore" hobbyist, so like many others I'm still trying to find the best ways.
Take Care,
SoCalTroy
Great story, but why do you say once-in-a-lifetime experience?, I hear that expression used all the time, and if it is really true, all I can say is that you are a man of little expectations.
FastEddie, you luckie dude!
There is one thing I would like to know: was she in your are by coincidence or, she made the trip to meet you or, did you have to fly her to you?
This little review of yours has made me change my mind on playmates. Before this, I had heard that playmates were great to look at but, not so good as scorts.
If there anymore info on your encounter that you could share privatelly e-mail me at: [email protected]
She was coming to my area for a convention, so we were able to hook up after it was over and before she went home.
As to Playmates, they're like anyone else... I'm sure some are good, and some aren't. I used to think that the pornstar escort was more of a sure thing, since they would tend to have less inhabitions than someone who's only claim to fame is that they've posed naked by themselves in a magazine... plus you have the pornstars movie as a gauge of what they're like...
But as we've all discovered, what a girl is like in a video isn't necessarily what she's like in person, and not only was my experience with a pornstar great, I know a guy who met a former Playmate of the Year, and he said she was much nastier and wilder than ANY pornstar he's met... So you just never know....
It is a very interesting question one raises, Eddie, very interesting.
I would start my saying that my pornstar experience is limited, but I have been enough of a hobbyist to know that one can never fully justify in dollars and cents any experience. If one starts with that premise, you can begin to get somewhere.
First, from just the negative side, the sting of the rip off - and I think any woman who doesn't try to provide a good experience to the client is a rip off - diminishes. Chalk one up to experience that you just ran into a bad person. You were never really going to get 'your money's worth' in the first place.
Second, I think one has to realize that when you have decided to pay $1500 or $2000 or whatever dollar amount for this or that provider, and you pick up the phone and schedule the appointment, you should be at your happiest. You have just decided you really believe in and deserve the fantasy that you have about that chosen provider. I find the reviews on this site very helpful sometimes, not because of the specific detail (although it is very good to know if a BBBJ or anal is in the cards), but because I can tell whether or not the provider's attitude is a good one. That fact helps me build the fantasy. And when the fantasy is powerful enough, I pick up the phone and realize it.
I do the mental equation on dollars - is the fantasy to me powerful enough for me to spend X?, but I don't think I ever really believe this or that provider is worth X.
And it is always true - in any city - that you can find a nonfamous person who just happens to be an absolutely great fuck. And does not charge the mega dollars. Obviously, from a pocket book experience, one should concentrate on finding those individuals.
But, when all is said and done, I do know that I will continue to have powerful fantasies about certain wowan, and because many men do, those women can charge what they do. I find myself wanting to know in my own mind that I really do want to live out the hour with that particular woman before I go to the ATM.
Eddie, you are the only guy who has commented on Kelly Jaye, and you wrote a good review. I have not seen her yet because I haven't crossed the line on desire. It ain't the dollars, it is the level of personal desire at this time. I fully expect that desire to grow, but something like a mediocre review could show up and change things.
I think one can be disappointed in an experience without being ripped off. I try to think of all good experiences as bargains and as good experiences. And if your recent experience was a bargain at $3000, that doesn't mean some other person at $2500 for less time won't be either.
Desire and fantasy are powerful things. I try to accept them.
Good points, johnter, and very true... The value of any fantasy can only be determined by the person who's fantasy it is.... I wouldn't cross the street to meet Madona, but I'm sure some wealthy guy out there would pay a Million Dollars to spend a night with her.
It's like guys on TER who go to escorts for massages.... They pay as much as $250 for a rub and maybe a handjob, and they're totally satisfied... they're fantasy has been fulfilled....
Where pricing comes into play though, it's not just how many guys out there have the fantasy that a particular girl is worth $2500, $3000, $1500, $25,000 or for that matter $500. Because it's the NUMBER of men who are willing to actually PAY a price that determine what that price is... A fantasy price is one thing... I WOULD pay $100,000 for an evening with Geena Nolan... so that sets the value of my fantasy... but I CAN'T pay it, simply because I can't afford it... so what I'm willing to pay really doesn't enter the real world economics of it... the supply and demand curves that govern even sexual transactions.