as it is buried in the post below... so here tis.... Gore and the frickin internet!

while Gore did not exactly say that he invented the internet... what he did say is actually worse... as on 9 March 1999 in an interview with Wolf Blitzer he stated

"....During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet."  

That is, he lead the group that created the internet!  lol!

"The first recorded description of the social interactions that could be enabled through networking was a series of memos written by J.C.R. Licklider of MIT in August 1962 discussing his "Galactic Network" concept. He envisioned a globally interconnected set of computers through which everyone could quickly access data and programs from any site. In spirit, the concept was very much like the Internet of today. Licklider was the first head of the computer research program at DARPA, 4 starting in October 1962. While at DARPA he convinced his successors at DARPA, Ivan Sutherland, Bob Taylor, and MIT researcher Lawrence G. Roberts, of the importance of this networking concept."

so in 1962 WHERE was FREAKY GORE!?  in 1962 he was what  14 yrs old...  oh, i get it he was working in his basement!  all the while... just like Bill Gates or Steven Jobs.... yea, thats right... workin in the basement

Seriously, Gore misspoke. he did NOT take the initiative in creating the internet.  It existed already.  He did lead the senate in pushing through legislation to fund an expansion of the existing network.

Get over yourselves... the guy exaggerates fact... or most often - fabricates "fact" from the musings of his mind.

Here's a statment from two of the authors from your link about Gore's involvement....

****************************************************************************
Al Gore and the Internet

By Robert Kahn and Vinton Cerf

Al Gore was the first political leader to recognize the importance of the
Internet and to promote and support its development.

No one person or even small group of persons exclusively "invented" the
Internet. It is the result of many years of ongoing collaboration among
people in government and the university community.  But as the two people
who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the
Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a
Congressman, Senator and as Vice President.  No other elected official, to
our knowledge, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of
time.

Last year the Vice President made a straightforward statement on his role.
He said: "During my service in the United States Congress I took the
initiative in creating the Internet."  We don't think, as some people have
argued, that Gore intended to claim he "invented" the Internet. Moreover,
there is no question in our minds that while serving as Senator, Gore's
initiatives had a significant and beneficial effect on the still-evolving
Internet. The fact of the matter is that Gore was talking about and
promoting the Internet long before most people were listening.  We feel it
is timely to offer our perspective.

As far back as the 1970s Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed
telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the
improvement of our educational system.   He was the first elected official
to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact
than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship. Though easily
forgotten, now, at the time this was an unproven and controversial
concept.  Our work on the Internet started in 1973 and was based on even
earlier work that took place in the mid-late 1960s. But the Internet, as
we know it today, was not deployed until 1983. When the Internet was still
in the early stages of its deployment, Congressman Gore provided
intellectual leadership by helping create the vision of the potential
benefits of high speed computing and communication.  As an example, he
sponsored hearings on how advanced technologies might be put to use in
areas like coordinating the response of government agencies to natural
disasters and other crises.

As a Senator in the 1980s Gore urged government agencies to consolidate
what at the time were several dozen different and unconnected networks
into an "Interagency Network."  Working in a bi-partisan manner with
officials in Ronald Reagan and George Bush's administrations, Gore secured
the passage of the High Performance Computing and Communications Act in
1991.  This "Gore Act" supported the National Research and Education
Network (NREN) initiative that became one of the major vehicles for the
spread of the Internet beyond the field of computer science.

As Vice President Gore promoted building the Internet both up and out, as
well as releasing the Internet from the control of the government agencies
that spawned it.  He served as the major administration proponent for
continued investment in advanced computing and networking and private
sector initiatives such as Net Day. He was and is a strong proponent of
extending access to the network to schools and libraries.  Today,
approximately 95% of our nation's schools are on the Internet. Gore
provided much-needed political support for the speedy privatization of the
Internet when the time arrived for it to become a commercially-driven
operation.

There are many factors that have contributed to the Internet's rapid
growth since the later 1980s, not the least of which has been political
support for its privatization and continued support for research in
advanced networking technology.  No one in public life has been more
intellectually engaged in helping to create the climate for a thriving
Internet than the Vice President.  Gore has been a clear champion of this
effort, both in the councils of government and with the public at large.

The Vice President deserves credit for his early recognition of the value
of high speed computing and communication and for his long-term and
consistent articulation of the potential value of the Internet to American
citizens and industry and, indeed, to the rest of the world.

Version 1.2
Word count: 709

=================================================================
Vint Cerf
WorldCom
22001 Loudoun County Parkway
Building F2, Room 4115, ATTN: Vint Cerf
Ashburn, VA 20147
Telephone (703) 886-1690
FAX (703) 886-0047


Alan M. Gaines
Senior Science Associate for Spatial Data and Information
National Science Foundation
4201 Wilson Blvd., Suite 1070
Arlington, VA 22230

Voice: +1.703.292.7857
FAX: +1.703.292.9152

email: [email protected]

what did you expect?  No federally funded scientist, myself included, is going to go against an elected (or potentially electable) politician.  Sorry, my statement stands.

These dudes are in for the funding - you want motivation? there it is - plain and simple.

Oh, and "from the 70's!?"  the concept was created in the 60's and potentially in the 50's but that is harder to support.  Al was first elected to the House in 77!  so?  help me here... as a jr rep. he did what for the 3 years remaining in the 70's?  

Really, this is about a poor choice of words - which would go away if someone would admit - that he misspoke.



-- Modified on 11/24/2007 10:45:50 AM

-- Modified on 11/24/2007 10:49:58 AM

What statement????

Then leave it as a 'poor choice of words'. You have such a hardon for Gore you'd bitch if he said the sky was blue.

Motivation? Funding? Sure, why not. What's your bitch? That Gore had some role to play in one of the most fundemental changes in communications since the invention of the telephone? And you can't stand it?

For the 70's, email Vinton Cerf, I'm sure he'll be glad to fill you in.

What is with you anyway?

Bringing this up seems to be far more a personal vendetta against Gore that anything else. My advice, get a life. Or a hooker.

of 1) his own importance 2) the contribution of many others and 3) historical fact.  What aggrevates so many on the Gore bandwagon is that he 'got caught.'  At least when Clinton got caught (that damn Blue GAP dress) he admitted something - called in the usual suspects to provide "spritual" guidance and was done with it.

How much govenment money could have been saved if he had just owned up to it in the first place, skipped the Senate hearings... and gone right to Jesse J for forgiveness.... well we'll never know.

but these are minor - compared to Ted Kennedy.  Minor.  and some would say minor compared to the quagmire that has become Iraq.  Minor.

Politics.
think I joke?!  

I don't.  Work with a federal agency that has grant money to divy up.  not a pretty picture.  there is a constant stream of e-mail and letters and phone calls to Washington DC and to the state capitals of all 50 states...  

Personal vendetta?  Nope.  just a "lets face facts folks!?" kinda bit of insight.  Gore wishes to fundamentally change YOUR life, in case you are unaware of it.  he wishes to place a tax on all energy that comes from Carbon - while prohibiting increased atomic energy - limiting hydroelectric and so on.  Why?  he wants to become the ultimate 'power broker'  

What do you think was going on between the white house (when Clinton was resident) and Enron?  This is all public and does not require me to provide you with links.

And the last part.... dude. just silly.  And you know it.

You're doing the Bush sidestep. You're  transmogrifying the original "I invented the Internet" complaint into a screed about federal funding distribution and carbon taxes.

If Messrs. Kahn and Cerf, no light weights themselves when it comes to the formation of the Internet, want to say that Mr. Gore played an important role in the creation of the Internet then so be it. And if you are shocked by it, then by all means you need to get a life.

Likewise you would also be equally dismayed to hear that Richard Mellon Scaife now feels that President Clinton maybe wasn't such a bad President after all.

We almost certainly would have been better off if this "dunderhead" as you so quaintly put it, would have been elected in 2000 than the current disaster we have on hand. No war in Iraq for starters, and that alone is worth the price. And if you think what you are involved with is bad, how can you reconcile with the fact that billions and billions of dollars have lost or wasted or unaccounted for in Iraq. And that the final bill, if ever, will be over a trillion dollars. What do you deal with, millions?

Carbon taxes. Maybe we should first remove the subsidies on fossil fuel production and let that cost hit the market first and let the "invisible hand of the market" sort things out first, eh?

Anybody with a Clinton/Gore obsession will have to prove to me that they do have a life.

-- Modified on 11/24/2007 12:47:51 PM

include the appropriations bills... and how they get generated.  oh, and do not forget the line items.... theys important too....

Subsidies on fossil fuel production?  then a use tax at the pump... and where does that money go?  

Make no mistake about it, if you have read my posts - you will see that while i think that having saddam gone is a good thing... I am fully NOT in support of the quagmire we are in.  I want bush gone from the office for many reasons - including the misadventure in Iraq... and others....  My list of why he needs to go is pretty long...

but elect someone as hapless as the current occupant of the WH?  Nope - even Clinton had his doubts about GORE.  Read my post above... clearly I will give credit where it is due.... but to one who "Transmorgafies" fact.... or invents fact... don't think so.

as I say, what did you think... that people dependant on their funding would trash someone who could be writing their pay check?  wow.... you've a lot to learn...

And again - the personal attack is noted.... and is really uncalled for.  and again - you know it.

that is, if he lies or exaggerates this, what else does he exaggerate or lie about?  and what is reality - vs.... the al gore version of it.  That is what troubles me.

you think he is lying or exaggerating, I don't. He may have clumsily put it to be sure, but not lying.

Messrs. Kahn and Cerf back him up on that but you just want to write it off as political grandstanding. You just still ranting on some seven year old right wing talking point.  

Mr. Gore is not one of the bad guys, expend your energy on the real living axis of evil, Bush,Cheney,Rumsfeld,et al. Those are targets worthy of your wrath. They've done much more to fuck up our county and its future much more than any carbon tax ever could. I could care less about your views about how the fed funds science when billions are being wasted in Iraq for what? Those are targets worthy of your wrath.

because unless we maintain the edge technologically we will find ourselves in the "new third world" - Read Friedman's "the world is flat" - kinda spooky... especially if you look at the mess our educational system is in.  And to not worry about how the feds fund science... just how do you think we have remained ahead technologically?  

but go ahead - think it not important... you want one of my resons to get BUSH outta the white house... his stupidity on Stem cell research...  that alone IMHO is reason to dump the dude.

Just because I point out the stupidity of one political asswipe, that does not mean I ignore the ignorant ranting of another....  I don't... again... see my post about intelligent presidents... and the rants against that!

-- Modified on 11/24/2007 4:17:03 PM

. . . in turning it from ARPANET into what we now call the Internet. Again, since Gore was in the Senate, and he was talking about his work in the Senate, as a politician. He wasn't interviewing for professor at MIT. What the hell gives you the idea that he could be referring to ANYTHING ELSE? That is the ONLY way it could be interpreted. It's an interpretation I made within two seconds. I'm surprised it could even still be a sticking point now.

Did you notice these paragraphs in your own link?

"Federal agencies shared the cost of common infrastructure, such as trans-oceanic circuits. They also jointly supported "managed interconnection points" for interagency traffic; the Federal Internet Exchanges (FIX-E and FIX-W) built for this purpose served as models for the Network Access Points and "*IX" facilities that are prominent features of today's Internet architecture.

"To coordinate this sharing, the Federal Networking Council 9 was formed. The FNC also cooperated with other international organizations, such as RARE in Europe, through the Coordinating Committee on Intercontinental Research Networking, CCIRN, to coordinate Internet support of the research community worldwide. . . .

"In 1988, a National Research Council committee, chaired by Kleinrock and with Kahn and Clark as members, produced a report commissioned by NSF titled "Towards a National Research Network". This report was influential on then Senator Al Gore, and ushered in high speed networks that laid the networking foundation for the future information superhighway."


While it doesn't say that Gore was key to getting funding it does confirm Gore's interest as far back as 1988-- and it makes it clear that there were Federal "initiatives" at this time.  Somebody was getting the funding for them.

Don't cite technical inventors when the subject is who funded it.

It was poor in terms of being obscure, but I'm surprised you haven't recognized this: almost any description of decision-making in the Senate is going to be obscure. It was a problem Gore shared with Kerry and Dole. The Senate is a club. About a dozen people are always sharing your accomplishments. Plus, in terms of invention, you don't "do" anything. You fund people who hopefully do something, and if you're a good Senator, people who do something useful.

that is the basic protocol that makes the internet possible... and again it was funded by DARPA(Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) Way long ago.

Interesting that many assume that the internet is a relatively recent "invention"!  it has existed in various forms for some time.  one of the resons that people looked into network sharing was to utilize more than one computer to work on complex problems....

One of the more interesting projects that was semi private was the SETI program that would download a multi channel analyzer onto a PC... along with data collected by the SETI radio telescope at ARECEBO http://www.naic.edu/  This telescope would collect data, but be limited by the ability to analyze the signals to discern an intelligent life generated signal...  voila, distributing the data to private PCs.... along with a screen saver program that would switch to signal analysis when the computer was not in use... and then send the results back to SETI....

I don't think that this program is still in play... but then again... don't know.  

So Z, in answer to your question yes... I am aware of what is in my post, However, I am also aware that a network preceeded and expanded into the internet.... and for a small while, I explored it prior to the internet...   you see, in the early days... universities were linked prior to the public being linked.  

curious that they are named after the senators who authored the bill.  and yet we have Gore....  hummm......!  gimme a break... he is too damn dumb to write a bill.... you snivelling little shit.  His comment had all the brighness of a 2 watt bulb.  he is so dumb that if his concepts were put into law you would not have a pot to piss in.  

Sheese.  the dumb ass scientists are never gonna call a legislative bully to task.  Why? because fully 60% of the operating budget of most universities comes directly from the federal tit you twit..... when is the last time you went into the guy who writes your paycheck and called him a jerk?  it is totally political.  Which is preciesely why I call for total educational reform.... we sit on our asses all day and cry chruch-govenment should be separate... well hey- here is a novel concept - how about govenment education should be separate.

Al Gore was even BORN.  The stuff that made it a sure thing (wanting more than you ever need to know) was invented in a Roman orgy in 48 BC by a guy named Somethingorother).

It's all a crock of shit.  You're just a virtual construct of Rube Goldberg's estate.

Again, you're arguing invention against funding.

Yes, I know something like the Internet has existed in some form for some time. Hence the references to DARPA, you know. I had heard about it, queried about it, but really didn't see it till 1994. I was glad of its arrival.

The internet protocols existed, but I believe that Al Gore more than likely helped get the funding that changed it from a university/DOD device to what we find today. It's similar to the fact that the can was invented 70 years before the can opener.  

I may have misinterpreted your meaning. I'm not against federal funding for science, on the contrary, we don't do anywhere near enough.

I think I combined some of your anti-academic polemics with the funding to jump to an erroneous conclusion.

...and was out of office when he accepted that award. He hadn't made "Inconvenient Truth" at the time, and he had no clear chance to get back into office. He lost his own state in the 2000 election, usually the end of a political career.

You're wrong about him writing laws. In fact, it seems he wrote a few laws. I found the one that he must be referring to when he made his "initiative" statement. Interesting its name seemed to never enter the debate, don't you think? "The High Performance Computing and Communication Act of 1991" which was also known as the Gore Bill. S.272  in the 102 Congress.

All this time, and I've neither heard nor read of anybody bringing this up. Why? Why haven't Republicans discussed it with this?

Do a little research of your own, here. Now tell me, with this accomplishment on his "resume," how does he explain it in an interview in so many words? No doubt, it is up to the interviewer to check the facts-- nobody did.

About the brightness of a 2 watt light bulb, could you explain your statement: "he is so dumb that if his concepts were put into law you would not have a pot to piss in." What a well-constructed, logical concept you've expressed here. So, let's see, since Gore is dumb, making his notions into law will deprive me of a pot to piss in, even if I don't use a pot but a toilet. You really have nothing on Gore here.

About our sick education system: I feel your pain but I don't see your plan. How the hell do you propose keeping scientists from being compliant to someone who pays them? How the hell do you take it out of anything? In your plan, who is going to replace the government after the overhaul? Or were you planning on a classless society where nobody had that much power? I just had to throw that out there.

You haven't shown anywhere in these posts that Gore is a legislative bully. All you've shown is that you're irritable about him, and worse, you think it's intelligent.

(The full text of the bill is on http://thomas.loc.gov/
The search expires too quick to give it as a reference. Put S.272 1991 into a search of the 102nd Congress.)


-- Modified on 11/27/2007 1:47:20 AM